For this article:

http://www.glowsticking.com/articles-and-t...man-on-gsc.html


Keep the discussions mature and be respectful of others. While different viewpoints are welcomed, anything discriminatory/derogatory post will be set to mod-preview and the member will be contacted about their behavior.

I'd personally like to thank each and every female GSCer right now. I agree Katt, the number of female glowstickers is hugely unbalanced, and I personally would like to see it increased, not just because they are girls, but because girls have a completely revolutionary approach to the idea.

For example. I know a girl who could easily qualify for Juliard(sp?) when she dances. I have even watched her dance thinking, wow, what if she was a glowsticker. BAM! instant idea. Girls on average are more flexible, more imaginative, and more energetic when it comes to sticking. I don't mean that as a dig to guys, but it's true.

The other truth of the matter I'll quote straight from you.


I have hung out or talked with some people in the raving scene, and a lot of the females I talk to have this "I can't do it, I'm not good enough." I personally think that they are. Aside from that, GSC isn't being good or bad. GSC is about pushing the art, breaking boundaries, and exploring everything the music brings out in us. GSC and the Glowsticking culture in general is hurting because of the lack of female stringers.

Note: I am giving a nod to the fact that I am a guy. There are guys out there who simply want to see girls dance so they can have a good excuse as to why he is stripping her mentally. I do not believe this is good or conducive to guys, girls, or the scene, and I am often ashamed when I see guys doing this.

Back on topic. I'd like to see more girls on the scene, be it in the studio dropping mixes, on camera busting out insane combos, or in the sidelines making tuts and spurring everyone on. Regardless of these things, I think sticking could benefit most out of having them on the floor, blowing our minds.

I'll just repeat what I thought earlier, my opinions haven't changed too much.





At least step 1 is done right? (IMG:http://www.glowsticking.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/ladiesdontgo.gif) (IMG:http://www.glowsticking.com/forums/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Interesting article. Good job, Katt. This is a fairly complicated topic, especially for those of us who hate making generalizations and treading on people's sensibilities.



Interesting point. You are right that something is up with that, and I wish you didn't feel this way. I know if I ever put up a vid, I would expect the courtesy of a fair and honest critique without sugar coating. While glowsticking is never about "being better" than others and going at your own pace, learning at an advanced level is about being better than yourself. When someone gets lots of praise and compliment for basic maneuvers, they are being done a disservice, and their learning will be slowed.

I urge anyone who thinks they have to be overly nice just to keep girls around to please lose that mentality. Respect and decency are necessary, but they are different from special attention. Pedestals are different from mutual respect. Just my opinion!

Edited copy-paste of my reply elsewhere, starting from Cody's comment.



Personal example: I'm an intermediate stringer. I have a pretty broad moveset but I'm not proficient yet at putting it together, so I don't bring it out in performances/practices around other people, and sometimes choke when I do.

I'm in a feedback dead zone; my skill doesn't warrant respect from the larger stringing community because I'm not actually "good", but I'm past the level of 3-beat-spamming, so I don't get the heaps of attention and encouragement that guys (1) seem to think that the girls need in order to keep them stringing or (2) funnel at the girls in hopes of talking to them more. I've been around too long for that.

So at this point, my progress is self-motivated. And this is the point where most stickergirls seem to disappear.

Lira, I have to say, as a guy who has been glowstringing for a month, i strive to hear people tell me what to work on... because thats what keeps me going, but at the same time... Cody brings up a great point, we don't know any other way to address the issue. For example, i have been stringing for 2 months, I need work on my transitions, and so far i have no style what so ever, and i need to figure out more wrap combos because they get repetitive *all told to me by Charl3y*.

But... its like fighting a girl to me, you think about it... guys fight guys, girls fight girls, there is no crossing, and even when it comes to constructive criticism, we are to afraid to give it because we don't want to hurt anyones "feelings" when really, we would only be helping them(sorry for the bad analogy lol). Honestly if your going to string for a month, you can't expect to be good, and even if you are good, theres always ways to improve.



Cody... i agree with everything that your saying because a friend and I were talking about the same thing just a few weeks ago, that there were very few females that we could name that were actually "good". Maybe treating everyone equally and not looking at there gender when we considered what we thought of there video would be the best way to go about things, and treating everyone the same way... *even if sometimes that makes you the asshole that posted something that wasn't as nice as everyone else"

O_O Just... a tricky topic for sure

Everything here is QFT.

I actually think this is the point where a lot of glowstickers in general drop off, except, generally girl stickers have already had praise an attention enough, and, like you said, are generally satisfied to step off. Sucks, but there it is.

You know, it is a shame. I have had many girls ask me to teach them, and beyond the butterfly and weave, they don't learn anything else. My personal opinion about why you don't see too many girls sticking or continuing to stick is because, well learning is painful. I don't care how good you are, everyone whacks themselves sometime. It hurts. Not to mention learning requires time and practice. I think most people, not just girls, are lazy. Not to mention, I don't intend to be sexist, but I've noticed with all the girls I've encountered (remember, most girls are not feminists by any means and are okay with the dominant position the male tends to take) are more content watching a guy spin than actually learning themselves.

I think these days (well, not just these days) a lot of girls don't develop the same amount of stamina as a lot of guys, so that could be the reason they drop off from some things like glowsticking.

True, a lot of girls always get that "OMG a girl! Awesome!" kind of reaction; there's no real judge on skill. Skill and experience seems to go out the window when a chick enters the scene. This isn't the most constructive thing, but I think that sometimes it's necessary. That little bit of a attention can motivate. If we didn't get any comments at all, then more of us probably wouldn't be involved.

Actually just for random thought my xgf, who i thought was real good, is the one that turned me on to gs'ing
I just thought I'd add that in here

It's funny because a lot of the people I know here how spin at all are girls. However, on that note, most of them started with glow and then almost instantly switched to fire, dropped the rave scene, claim to hold onto PLUR values, and are now trying to perform/promote themselves as a glowstringer who does fire.

And it really sucks because then all the guys want to go out and help them with their fire and such (which looks badass) but then I'm kinda stuck getting no feedback whatsoever because I'm terrified of fire. -.- constructive criticism is like oxygen. I need it to thrive on.

Average American culture (and most cultures) teaches girls to be inferior in their equality. I think it's super sad. I know a lot of girls who don't try simply because they feel like it would make them unpopular, or because they've been taught to be unconfident all their life, even though they're just as good as anyone else. I don't blame just the media, although that is certainly part of the problem. When all you see on TV is girls who are either artsy or simply take up space and buy clothes, you don't get any really good role models for young girls to aspire too. I would like to see more Dr. Brennan characters on TV (the "Bones" chick). The only problem with that character is they make her totally socially inept, in a way. Girls want to be sociable and should ALSO want to be successful. Men definitely don't help, with lingo like "you throw like a girl" (okay... straight fact, men have more muscle mass and are better at most sports, sorry but it needs to be said), you get confidence-lowering terminology ingrained in common vocabulary, which has considerable psychological effects.

(Genetically and anatomically speaking, men are technically superior in strength to women if both are given the same and equal amounts of training because of the hunter/gatherer roles from way back in the day when men really had to hunt in order to find food, and women gathered instead. So scientifically speaking, there's grounds to the sayings but in the modern age they need to start being abolished. It's kind of like the same way some people go "that's so gay" when they hear something they don't like.)

A lot of the female role models we have in society now have some sort of fundamental flaw that makes people go "she's awesome and all, BUT..." I mean another character I can think of in a TV series is Catherine Willows from CSI; she's sharp, tough as nails, savvy as hell but single mother and former exotic dancer whose father was involved with load of shady dealings before he got offed in season.. I don't remember.

The way women have been characterized in the media and social norms has led to a lot of girls just giving up before they really reach their potential. I don't see it in just glowsticking, but in other aspects as well. One of my friends in school flakes on more things than I can list off of the top of my head because she thinks she's not good in anything she tries and gives up.

It's unfortunate because of the fact that some women have a natural advantage over men in terms of movement and fluidity. A lot of what I see in freehanding now is "male" movement (not to be sexist or anything, but men and women are just built differently), and I think that's an issue for some of our female freehanders when they're trying to learn combos from videos. If you take the combinations and the movements and transplant them onto a female glowsticker, it doesn't look as natural as it should. This is probably where a lot of the frustration and quitting stems from when girls realize that they won't look as good as guys will, because they're not doing movements that are more suited for their bodies.

Awesome article. Would love to see more women not give up on something they truly enjoy doing. I myself starting way back in highschool nerd. No movement/ no rhythm/ no concept of anything. 8 Years later as in my comment says:

"Music is my Soul"
"Dance is my Expression"
"Passion is my Fuel"

There's always room for improvement. That's what I find most enjoyable in any art, The mental capacity for expansion. Keep dancing, don't give up, do your best and you can't go wrong. Good luck to all you female dancers out there!

I personally love it when girls glowstick. I always encourage anyone who picks up the sticks and have taught plenty of girls the basic moves. As a guy myself i cant speculate on why they give up or not. My wifes chief complaints are "sticks hurt" so i got her some poi socks.

I must be a strange glowsticker.
I am female and I freehand more than string.

But I don't think I have a masculine style. In fact I know I move differently than a guy naturally.
I notice I take a lot more emphasis on my lines, my spins, and even perform toss and catching routines in a slightly different approach.

You can move like a girl in EVERY dance.
Its all about lines, when I freehand I do a lot of traces and I see myself differently than any other freehander on the board.

I get inspired by the guys and am Amazed at their dexterity.

I spin too but to be honest I'd rather give lightshows to everyone, I guess that's the tom-boy perspective of me. I've always been close with guys and felt more connected to them growing up.

I really like the styles of GIRL freehanders because of the way we think differently when it comes to body movement.

Watch Reahzzz and HeeYoun-Sohn trace. Their flow and musicality is completely feminine.

Freehanding can be PUSHED so much as a dance and show a great deal of grace and flow not entirely explored seriously by the females of this site.

I want to see it thrive and get to another level.

More females need to freehand.

-RG

I just like to watch girls in general, but if they got something to offer other than eye candy that's a bonus.

Girls on GS.C. Big deal. Girls are everywhere. We see them everyday.

Sure, it might be different to see a girl stringing and sticking, considering it's a skill mostly men would waste their time practicing and executing.
But it's just that: different. So yeah, a girl is going to get a little extra attention.

But come on. It's just a girl. (Not trying to sound like an asshole when I say that.)

It isn't like girls never do cool things like this.

Keep going, girls. Continue stringing, sticking, whatever.
Same goes to guys. It isn't like you have never seen a girl before.

(This post was by no means an intentional attack on guys or girls. I'm just stating that girls are nothing new.)

And, I mean, honestly, girls have the potential to be much better at this art than most guys. Lets face it: girls tend to be much more graceful than us, much more fluid... I mean, it is a dance after all. xD

uh..

"Girls on average are more flexible, more imaginative, and more energetic when it comes to sticking. I don't mean that as a dig to guys, but it's true." -dreihartezero

could you please provide a little more proof of this than the bare assertion fallacy?

/EDIT/
same to Glowing GenetLoki: if you are going to argue the inferiority of a gender please provide a more compelling argument.